Software that makes placemats

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RAYC
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by RAYC » 17:10 Mon 19 Dec 2011

jdaw1 wrote:
jdaw1 wrote:
Glenn E. wrote:and would like to continue having the option of them being on the placemat itself.
Wilco.
But what if there aren’t placemats? What if it’s stickies? AHB’s suggestion of a water-box sticky is growing on me and it wouldn’t have to be stuck to a glass.
Or...

we could invest in some of these for use at tastings, obviating the need for tick boxes altogether!

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jdaw1
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 17:54 Mon 19 Dec 2011

The nurses would need tick-boxes.

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RAYC
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by RAYC » 18:41 Mon 19 Dec 2011

jdaw1 wrote:The nurses would need tick-boxes.
Good point.

In which case there is some merit to the solution of tick boxes on stickers (that are then stuck to the table/a glass/a watch face/ the back of your palm)

However, tick boxes on placemats should, i feel, be the default. There are not too many tastings that do not involve placemats.
Last edited by RAYC on 18:46 Mon 19 Dec 2011, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by DRT » 18:45 Mon 19 Dec 2011

Perhaps the nurses should only wear stickers?
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jdaw1
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 18:59 Mon 19 Dec 2011

RAYC wrote:However, tick boxes on placemats should, i feel, be the default. There are not too many tastings that do not involve placemats.
That is already agreed. We are dealing with the difficult cases, not the ordinary cases.

RAYC wrote:In which case there is some merit to the solution of tick boxes on stickers (that are then stuck to the table/a glass/a watch face/ the back of your palm)
Next I need to think about how to parametrise this.

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jdaw1
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 21:29 Mon 02 Jan 2012

Note to self: the fonts available on both home and work computers are as follows.
  1. /Arial-Black
  2. /Arial-BoldItalicMT
  3. /Arial-BoldMT
  4. /Arial-ItalicMT
  5. /ArialMT
  6. /ArialNarrow
  7. /ArialNarrow-Bold
  8. /ArialNarrow-BoldItalic
  9. /ArialNarrow-Italic
  10. /BookAntiqua
  11. /BookAntiqua-Bold
  12. /BookAntiqua-BoldItalic
  13. /BookAntiqua-Italic
  14. /BookmanOldStyle
  15. /BookmanOldStyle-Bold
  16. /BookmanOldStyle-BoldItalic
  17. /BookmanOldStyle-Italic
  18. /Calibri
  19. /Calibri-Bold
  20. /Calibri-BoldItalic
  21. /Calibri-Italic
  22. /Cambria
  23. /Cambria-Bold
  24. /Cambria-BoldItalic
  25. /Cambria-Italic
  26. /Candara
  27. /Candara-Bold
  28. /Candara-BoldItalic
  29. /Candara-Italic
  30. /Century
  31. /CenturyGothic
  32. /CenturyGothic-Bold
  33. /CenturyGothic-BoldItalic
  34. /CenturyGothic-Italic
  35. /ComicSansMS
  36. /ComicSansMS-Bold
  37. /Consolas
  38. /Consolas-Bold
  39. /Consolas-BoldItalic
  40. /Consolas-Italic
  41. /Constantia
  42. /Constantia-Bold
  43. /Constantia-BoldItalic
  44. /Constantia-Italic
  45. /Corbel
  46. /Corbel-Bold
  47. /Corbel-BoldItalic
  48. /Corbel-Italic
  49. /Courier
  50. /Courier-Bold
  51. /Courier-BoldOblique
  52. /Courier-Oblique
  53. /CourierNewPS-BoldItalicMT
  54. /CourierNewPS-BoldMT
  55. /CourierNewPS-ItalicMT
  56. /CourierNewPSMT
  57. /CourierStd
  58. /CourierStd-Bold
  59. /CourierStd-BoldOblique
  60. /CourierStd-Oblique
  61. /FranklinGothic-Medium
  62. /FranklinGothic-MediumItalic
  63. /Garamond
  64. /Garamond-Bold
  65. /Garamond-Italic
  66. /Georgia
  67. /Georgia-Bold
  68. /Georgia-BoldItalic
  69. /Georgia-Italic
  70. /Haettenschweiler
  71. /Impact
  72. /LucidaBright
  73. /LucidaBright-Demi
  74. /LucidaBright-DemiItalic
  75. /LucidaBright-Italic
  76. /LucidaConsole
  77. /LucidaSans
  78. /LucidaSans-Demi
  79. /LucidaSans-DemiItalic
  80. /LucidaSans-Italic
  81. /LucidaSans-Typewriter
  82. /LucidaSans-TypewriterBold
  83. /LucidaSansUnicode
  84. /MicrosoftSansSerif
  85. /MinionPro-Bold
  86. /MinionPro-BoldIt
  87. /MinionPro-It
  88. /MinionPro-Regular
  89. /MonotypeCorsiva
  90. /MSReferenceSansSerif
  91. /MyriadPro-Bold
  92. /MyriadPro-BoldIt
  93. /MyriadPro-It
  94. /MyriadPro-Regular
  95. /Tahoma
  96. /Tahoma-Bold
  97. /TimesNewRomanPS-BoldItalicMT
  98. /TimesNewRomanPS-BoldMT
  99. /TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT
  100. /TimesNewRomanPSMT
  101. /Trebuchet-BoldItalic
  102. /TrebuchetMS
  103. /TrebuchetMS-Bold
  104. /TrebuchetMS-Italic
  105. /Verdana
  106. /Verdana-Bold
  107. /Verdana-BoldItalic
  108. /Verdana-Italic

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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by DRT » 12:54 Sun 08 Jan 2012

In the discussion thread Quantifying opacity
jdaw1 wrote:To assess, look at the circle text through about 1cm of port in a titled glass.
Perhaps we could devise a standard way of doing this by using a feature on the placemats?

Imagine a horizontal bar about 5mm wide running across the bottom of a Placemat or TN sheet. The bar is white at one end and black at the other, with all of the shades of grey in between. Written inside the bar, in a black font, are the gradients 0%, 10%, 20% ! 100%, the latter of which would be invisible.

Now place a tilted glass above one end of the bar and move it along until you cannot read the number below it. That is the opacity of the wine.

Would that work?
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jdaw1
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 13:02 Sun 08 Jan 2012

A good idea.

➊ I’d like the test to be based on something standard, recommended by those expert in this field.

âž‹ Different printer resolutions can make different greys appear quite different. Might that confound the attempt at standardisation? (Also, but I think less, different toners might be a problem.)

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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by RAYC » 13:23 Sun 08 Jan 2012

Or invest in one of these...
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by DRT » 13:28 Sun 08 Jan 2012

jdaw1 wrote:A good idea.

➊ I’d like the test to be based on something standard, recommended by those expert in this field.

âž‹ Different printer resolutions can make different greys appear quite different. Might that confound the attempt at standardisation? (Also, but I think less, different toners might be a problem.)
On 2, provided the 100% was invisible or as good as, and the graduation of grey looked consistent, I don't think the variation of printer/toner would have much effect.

Perhaps if someone very clever could produce a test sheet we could each print a copy of it and bring them to the Bunghole to test whether or not the printer variation is significant. The test sheet does not have to part of the placemets.
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by DRT » 13:29 Sun 08 Jan 2012

RAYC wrote:Or invest in one of these...
I'm no expert, but I suspect it would be extremely difficult to embed one of those into Postscript.
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by AHB » 20:44 Sun 08 Jan 2012

DRT wrote:
jdaw1 wrote:A good idea.

➊ I’d like the test to be based on something standard, recommended by those expert in this field.

âž‹ Different printer resolutions can make different greys appear quite different. Might that confound the attempt at standardisation? (Also, but I think less, different toners might be a problem.)
On 2, provided the 100% was invisible or as good as, and the graduation of grey looked consistent, I don't think the variation of printer/toner would have much effect.

Perhaps if someone very clever could produce a test sheet we could each print a copy of it and bring them to the Bunghole to test whether or not the printer variation is significant. The test sheet does not have to part of the placemets.
I agree with DRT - if the 100% is invisible then this should be a self-balancing test.

An alternative approach might be to print a small ruler along one edge of the test; then to tip the glass and measure the distance from the rim at which the ruler becomes invisible. We could conduct some tests to develop an agreed standard.
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by Glenn E. » 20:56 Sun 08 Jan 2012

AHB wrote:An alternative approach might be to print a small ruler along one edge of the test; then to tip the glass and measure the distance from the rim at which the ruler becomes invisible. We could conduct some tests to develop an agreed standard.
This is similar to (better than, really) the method I use to judge very young Ports. I judge pencil-widths visible at the rim, but a ruler would be more precise and allow for rating older Ports as well.

The key to this system is a consistent fill level in a standard shape glass. This might be difficult at a larger tasting where pour sizes are smaller, but I think it's a relatively easy system to use.
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by SushiNorth » 21:30 Sun 08 Jan 2012

In the sake world, clarity is measured by putting the sake into a white ceramic glass with two blue circles in the bottom (bullseye-like). At equal pour for each sake, the judge can differentiate clarity and color.
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 21:38 Sun 08 Jan 2012

People might want to do the opacity test in different light, so will want to be able to hold it. Hence it must be on the TN sheets rather than the glasses sheets.

Is what is wanted anything like this?

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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by DRT » 21:51 Sun 08 Jan 2012

jdaw1 wrote:Is what is wanted anything like this?
That is what I had in mind, although the version I had in my head had white on the left and black on the right.

I think the bar needs to be quite wide so that the precision with which you have to hit the right spot becomes easier.
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 21:54 Sun 08 Jan 2012

DRT wrote:That is what I had in mind, although the version I had in my head had white on the left and black on the right.
With numbers descending, 9 to 1? Ascending numbers seemed more natural to me, though it is easy to change.

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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by DRT » 21:56 Sun 08 Jan 2012

jdaw1 wrote:
DRT wrote:That is what I had in mind, although the version I had in my head had white on the left and black on the right.
With numbers descending, 9 to 1? Ascending numbers seemed more natural to me, though it is easy to change.
No. White on the left = 0% (as in fully transparent) and black on the right being 100% (as in 100% opaque).
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 21:59 Sun 08 Jan 2012

Are you sure? I think the ‟9” of ‟90%” needs to be against very pale grey. If you can’t see black on 10% grey, then the port is ≥90% opaque.

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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 22:13 Sun 08 Jan 2012

Updated test page.

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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by DRT » 22:14 Sun 08 Jan 2012

That is what I meant when I asked...
DRT wrote:Would that work?
You are, of course, correct. My idea was in the early stages of development when I wrote the first post. Thankfully there are people here who can take semi-flawed ideas and make them work :D
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 00:54 Mon 09 Jan 2012

Updated test page.

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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by Glenn E. » 17:59 Mon 09 Jan 2012

DRT wrote:
jdaw1 wrote:Is what is wanted anything like this?
That is what I had in mind, although the version I had in my head had white on the left and black on the right.
That's because you're Scottish.
jdaw1 wrote:Are you sure? I think the ‟9” of ‟90%” needs to be against very pale grey. If you can’t see black on 10% grey, then the port is ≈90% opaque.
The numbers are reversed to me. We're judging opacity, not the printed greyscale, so to me the numbers should indicate the opacity of the Port. I cannot be expected to do math while consuming alcohol. 
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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 18:31 Mon 09 Jan 2012

Printing on two laserprinters gives different apparent greys. As a form of standardisation, this is miserable. (Though within each printer, the four lines are very similar.)

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Re: Software that makes placemats

Post by jdaw1 » 19:43 Mon 09 Jan 2012

To help those unwilling to open a PDF:
Image

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