Warre II, 17 April 2010

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jdaw1
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Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by jdaw1 » 14:44 Wed 14 Apr 2010

Warre II, the rematch, this time in Sussex on Saturday 17th April 2010. Links: Placemats; Review of the evening as a whole; TNs of 1945, 1947, 1948, 1955, 1958, 1960, 1963, 1966, 1970, 1977, 1980, 1983, 1985.

Though it appears on the placemats, 1934 was not opened and its tasting-note thread has been deleted.

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Chris Doty
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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by Chris Doty » 12:24 Thu 15 Apr 2010

Perhaps now is a good time to mention that I am free on the evening of the 17th. Don't know where Sussex is, but will happily buy a map to attend the tasting!

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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by jdaw1 » 12:31 Thu 15 Apr 2010

Understandable, but the finite number of seats are all taken.

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Chris Doty
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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by Chris Doty » 12:33 Thu 15 Apr 2010

Blast.

Well, should there be any last minute dropouts, you know where to find me.

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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by DRT » 02:48 Sun 18 Apr 2010

I regret to inform you all that following a heroic battle through Warre II only one brave soldier remains in action. I will struggle on until i go MIA or the objective is acheived. Over and out.
"The first duty of Port is to be red"

Ernest H. Cockburn

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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by benread » 17:41 Sun 18 Apr 2010

One of the most impressive things about this line up was how consistent the ports were and the way in which they allowed us to see how Warre evolves over time. Only the 1980 stood out as being very different - much darker than the 1983. The peak for Warre seems to come at about 40-45 years, with the 1966 and 1070 being my favourite wines of the night.

The older wines remind me on reflection of an actor such as Roger Moore - still cherished, no longer quite as good as he was in his prime, but justifiably still a firm favourite with many!

A toast was drunk to our absent friend, prevented from attending at the last minute by the Icelandic situation.

Thank you Julian, and to Richard and Sandra, for being fantastic hosts.
Last edited by benread on 21:05 Sun 18 Apr 2010, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by DRT » 19:56 Sun 18 Apr 2010

benread wrote:One of the most impressive things about this line up was how consistent the ports were and the way in which they allowed us to see how Dow evolves over time.
That is indeed an impressive outcome from a tasting of Warre vintages.

A splendid weekend indeed. Many thanks are due to our host Dr Richard Wiseman and his charming wife, Sandra, who is undoubtedly the most fabulous hostess I have ever had the pleasure of meeting. I feel as though anything I eat from this point forward will seem inferior. That is, if I ever manage to eat anything ever again. Thanks are also due to Julian for arranging such a fantastic weekend for us. Thank you Team Wiseman, it was very good of you to host this event and to feed and water us so magnificently.

I agree with Ben's assessment of the wines. There was remarkable consistency from around 1963 back to 1945 which, for me, demonstrates that Warre achieves its objective of being of consistent quality in the long term. The older wines were light and delicate, no big tannic monsters, just good solid and reliable vintage port. The 1980 was the odd man out. Extremely dark and still a baby at 30 years old, much like the Dow of the same vintage. I wonder of the Symingtons done something differently in 1980?

My WOTN was the 55, followed closely by the 66.

Thanks again to our hosts.

Derek
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Ernest H. Cockburn

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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by Axel P » 20:07 Mon 19 Apr 2010

Excellent tasting and I am very jealous not being there. Maybe we should look out for some W66 to show op at auctions as it was my WOTN on both recent tasting which implied this wine (66/67) and the Warre Vertical in October last year. Sadly I do not even own a single bottle.

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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by AHB » 13:54 Wed 21 Apr 2010

I can't add much new to what has already been said. Julian, his father and step-mother looked after us wonderfully well and over-fed us with the most exquisite food.

The Warres were remarkably consistent, reaching a peak with the '55 and '66. Once older than this, there was a remarkable consistency and elegance to the '45, the '47 and the '48 with these being almost identical in colour and flavour. I summarised the style as elegant, floral and balanced. These are wines which reach their peak to my taste at around 25-30 years and then drink well for at least another 30-40 years while they move comfortably from secondary phase to tertiary phase without losing any of their charm or elegance.

My favourites on the night were the 1955 (92 pts) and the 1970 (91 pts). Not big, burly blockbusters but if you offered me this port to drink when I visited your house then I would consider you to be a good friend.
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Chris Doty
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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by Chris Doty » 13:59 Wed 21 Apr 2010

Wow -- that's an interesting post, Alex. I don't mean to be too fixated on points, but I'm a bit surprised to see how low your highest marks were for the tasting, and particularly the manner in which they contrast the Vesuvio scores.

Is this mostly a attributable to a strong stylistic preference, or is there some other explanation for why the Warre's didn't seem to do much for you?

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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by AHB » 14:17 Wed 21 Apr 2010

I'm known for being a relatively low scorer. 90-92 from me means that in my opinion this is a very tasty wine and one which brings a lot of enjoyment. 85-89 is a good wine that is one to buy and drink. 80-84 would be a good wine that is one to buy and drink if the price is right.

93+ points means that we are talking about a serious wine that might well command a big price. In the last week, out of perhaps 40 different ports I've tasted, only the Graham 1977, 2007 and Fonseca 2007 received scores of 93+

Stylistically, I also love the Vesuvio flavour profile so perhaps these wines tend to score a point or two more from me than other styles.
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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by Chris Doty » 15:50 Wed 21 Apr 2010

Thanks. I suppose I guess I am just a bit surprised (depressed?) that in your estimation the best Warre is roughly equivalent to the 1995 Vesuvio (both 92s).

Again, I really don't mean to get hung up on points, as I believe they are more of a signpost than a destination, but as a general metric, I just would have expected Warre to show better. But, different strokes for different folks.

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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by DRT » 23:37 Wed 21 Apr 2010

Chris Doty wrote:I really don't mean to get hung up on points
Then why are you hung up on points?
"The first duty of Port is to be red"

Ernest H. Cockburn

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Chris Doty
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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by Chris Doty » 10:08 Thu 22 Apr 2010

Well, I think people use them because it is helpful to have some objective benchmark by which the relative quality of wines can be judged, to communicate preferences more clearly and to help inform buying/drinking decisions. They are not perfect, but they are helpful.

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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by Glenn E. » 22:06 Thu 22 Apr 2010

Chris Doty wrote:the best Warre is roughly equivalent to the 1995 Vesuvio (both 92s).
You say that as if it is a bad thing. The 1995 Vesuvio is a superb Port, and in fact I'm somewhat shocked that AHB rates it only 92 even considering both his reputation for scoring somewhat low and for loving Vesuvio.
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Re: Warre II, 17 April 2010

Post by Christopher » 23:04 Thu 22 Apr 2010

A most wonderful tasting! Thank you for the fantastic hospitality of Mr and Mrs Wiseman senior. The most wonderful food and company. Sadly I went rather downhill healthwise and had to duck out embarrassingly early. Thank you Julian for all the hard work that you put in orgaining the excellent tasting. Lovely to have all the ports from decanters.
I have a soft spot for Warre as it is the first case of port I ever owned- the 1983. I still have a couple of bottles left. Quinta de Cavadinha is a wonderful property and Ithink the Symingtons are doing some really interesting work there.
I am looking back at my notes which are much fuller than normal! My favourite port of the evening was the 1966 which had a wonderful long finish. I agree that the older ports had a lot of consistency, in my view marmalade was the key taste I got in the earlier vintages.
A very interesting tasting, good port, good food and good company - that is what the Port Forum is all about!

Thank you Julian and Wiseman's senior!

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