Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

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AHB
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Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by AHB » 18:26 Mon 08 Aug 2011

Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Monday 8th August 2011, at The Steak Exchange, 2 Exchange Square, London EC2A 2EH.

Links: Paris Annexe: (This post reconstructed by jdaw1, with the permission of AHB.)
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Re: 8th August - port from the nineties

Post by benread » 00:56 Tue 09 Aug 2011

AHB wrote:Morgan 1991 - opened while waiting for everyone else to arrive
Mostly drunk as well!
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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by jdaw1 » 11:05 Tue 09 Aug 2011

[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=43927#p43927]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:
  • And, slightly kludged, a ‘What is it?’ page. Comment encouraged.
[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=43952#43952]Here[/url] AHB wrote:A way to record guesses for posterity. I'm happy to try this out on 8th August.
[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=43953#43953]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:Please scan and upload the sheet it’s OK, you will all be rubbish, as would I if I were there and comment on the technology.
[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=44122#p44122]Here[/url] RAYC wrote:Should the "total" field in the guess recorder be a column corresponding to the wines (as currently drafted) or a row at the bottom to correspond to the drinkers? (or perhaps both, giving two totals - best guesser, most guessed)
[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=44124#44124]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:Updated draft of the placemats.
  • Kludged improvement to ‟What is it?” sheet. Comment on this would be welcomed.
What is written in the rectangles is the names of wines, abbreviated. So totalling these will be more arduous than totalling numerical scores (3 for first place; 2 for second; 1 third). Further design work probably needed.
Comment encouraged.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by RAYC » 09:10 Wed 10 Aug 2011

oh wow...i was feeling rather special yesterday...

- VP from the early 90s drinking rather well now I think - 91s in particular seem already quite advanced but in a nice place. Maybe not blockbusters, but very pleasant.

- There's some real quality in the '97s - the Roeda '97 was hailed as "serious port from a serious vintage" and guesses included Fonseca 94 (x2), Taylor 94, Dow 94 and Noval 94. NTB.

- I enjoyed both Eira Vehla VPs immensely. Pity there's not much availability as i would love to pick up some '92

- The Morgan '91 was a fantastic buy

- JacobH should try the Ramos Pinto '94 in answer to his comment here

I have WOTN and Guesses - will scan later.
Rob C.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by RAYC » 09:28 Wed 10 Aug 2011

jdaw1 wrote:
[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=44124#44124]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:Updated draft of the placemats.
  • Kludged improvement to ‟What is it?” sheet. Comment on this would be welcomed.
What is written in the rectangles is the names of wines, abbreviated. So totalling these will be more arduous than totalling numerical scores (3 for first place; 2 for second; 1 third). Further design work probably needed.
Comment encouraged.
- Guesses are an interesting record of people's impressions of the port (see comment re: Roeda above)

- A slight concern from some that the process of gathering votes after every round got in the way of relaxed conversation. Though i would imagine that this would be less of an issue at a smaller tasting with fewer bottles.

- We are all terrible - top score was 6 points out of a possible 28 (1 point for vintage, 1 for shipper). Across all 8 people, there was only one correct guess at shipper. Scores for correct identification of vintage were no doubt flattered by the fact that we only had a choice of 10 years (or 9, discounting 1993)!

- The sheet worked well, and totalling points was not an arduous task. I had slight difficulty when drunk with recording votes in the correct columns...though this is not a criticism of the sheet itself!

- Inclusion of an extra row or two for extra ports would be good.
Rob C.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by jdaw1 » 11:37 Wed 10 Aug 2011

OK, the placemat part of the discussion to be continued in the thread about the placemat software.
RAYC wrote:- We are all terrible - top score was 6 points out of a possible 28 (1 point for vintage, 1 for shipper).
The plan was that the Mg91 would unblinded, so there were only thirteen blind ports, meaning a maximum score of 26. Or perhaps it was done differently.
RAYC wrote:Across all 8 people, there was only one correct guess at shipper. Scores for correct identification of vintage were no doubt flattered by the fact that we only had a choice of 10 years (or 9, discounting 1993)!
[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=43953#p43953]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:you will all be rubbish, as would I if I were there and comment on the technology.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by DRT » 17:49 Wed 10 Aug 2011

A very interesting time indeed.

There was something splendidly British about a group of middle-aged men drinking copious amounts of vintage port and eating large steaks whilst London burned around us. A TPF version of the band playing as Titanic went down. Well done chaps, we showed them how gentlemen should behave in a crisis.

As RAYC says, the 1990s are starting to drink very well and it was extremely difficult to separate most of them. Unfortunately, someone seems to have looted my tasting notes on the way home so I can offer little in terms of specific comments on the ports :roll:

Thanks to the team for a great evening and to JDAW for helping select the ports and making the placemats.
"The first duty of Port is to be red"

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by jdaw1 » 18:21 Wed 10 Aug 2011

DRT wrote:Unfortunately, someone seems to have looted my tasting notes on the way home so I can offer little in terms of specific comments on the ports
I saw them: the ports tasted of melons.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by PhilW » 09:00 Thu 11 Aug 2011

I thoroughly enjoyed Mon night, both for the chance to expand my exprience with different ports and for the opportunity to meet more TPF-ers. Unfortunately my tasting notes were swept up in the end of night clean-up which is a pity (probably due to my slightly less than sober state and hence failure to rescue them in time).

The Morgan 91 was WOTN for me; in fact I was so impressed with it that were it more easily available, I would happily accept it as my 'new VP' to replace the Warre 77 once stocks run out - however I think the Morgan 91 will run out first. Will be interested to see the guesses/wotn sheets in retrospect :)

I also found Tuesday morning to be "an experience" - in future perhaps more judicious use of sample bottles and less "drinking every glass and finishing off what was left" - plus what was that bottle which was magically produced (by Rob) and opened at the end, a 'palette cleanser' after we'd finished off all the port?

Phil.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by RAYC » 10:21 Thu 11 Aug 2011

I have been thinking more about this tasting over the last couple of days and have come to the conclusion that the 91s and 92s merit further investigation.

There are some interesting ideas discussed in this thread

In tastings like this, i also quite enjoy the "themes within themes". The Malvedos mini line-up provided by WS1 was a lot of fun - my favourite (against the grain) being the '90.
Rob C.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by RAYC » 12:00 Thu 11 Aug 2011

PhilW wrote: - plus what was that bottle which was magically produced (by Rob) and opened at the end, a 'palette cleanser' after we'd finished off all the port?
London Meantime Porter, though my preference is for Samuel Smith's Famous Taddy Porter, which is (in my opinion) the perfect post-Port drink.
Rob C.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by AHB » 12:39 Thu 11 Aug 2011

RAYC wrote:I have been thinking more about this tasting over the last couple of days and have come to the conclusion that the 91s and 92s merit further investigation.

There are some interesting ideas discussed in this thread

In tastings like this, i also quite enjoy the "themes within themes". The Malvedos mini line-up provided by WS1 was a lot of fun - my favourite (against the grain) being the '90.
Neither should we lose Christopher's comment that he would like to try a similar "port from the 90s" theme but with more of the big names included in the line up.
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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by jdaw1 » 12:49 Thu 11 Aug 2011

Request: when there is a blind tasting with a Director, please could people send multiple possibilities, consistent with the official theme, in advance. Some did. Some didn’t have the port so were more limited. But some, with access to enough port to be more helpful, weren’t.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by benread » 19:04 Thu 11 Aug 2011

RAYC wrote:
PhilW wrote: - plus what was that bottle which was magically produced (by Rob) and opened at the end, a 'palette cleanser' after we'd finished off all the port?
London Meantime Porter, though my preference is for Samuel Smith's Famous Taddy Porter, which is (in my opinion) the perfect post-Port drink.
I had completely forgotten about that!
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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by RAYC » 13:43 Fri 12 Aug 2011

Results from WOTN:

1st: 11pts - Ramos Pinto 1994
2nd=: 10pts - Eira Vehla 1992, Delaforce 1992
Honourable mentions: Morgan 1991 (3pts), Malvedos 1990 (3pts), Malvedos 1992 (2pts), Malvedos 1995 (2pts), Warre 1991 (1pt)

Please let me know if you would like me to email a copy of the WOTN, Guess and Decanting Note sheets. I do not appear to be able to upload them from work, so it will be next week sometime before i can post here.
Rob C.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by jdaw1 » 19:31 Fri 12 Aug 2011

Image

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by jdaw1 » 19:32 Fri 12 Aug 2011

Image
The original guesses, pre-tidying, are at www.jdawiseman.com/port/rayc/20110808_r ... iginal.jpg.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by jdaw1 » 19:33 Fri 12 Aug 2011

Image
The original WOTN sheet, pre-tidying, is at www.jdawiseman.com/port/rayc/20110808_r ... iginal.jpg.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by jdaw1 » 19:36 Fri 12 Aug 2011

The decanting notes are not excessively legible. Was there insufficient space?

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by AHB » 23:44 Fri 12 Aug 2011

jdaw1 wrote:The decanting notes are not excessively legible. Was there insufficient space?
I think more space would be better - perhaps twice the space that we did have?
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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by jdaw1 » 00:01 Sat 13 Aug 2011

AHB wrote:I think more space would be better - perhaps twice the space that we did have?
Easily done. Noted for next time.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by Andy Velebil » 16:11 Sat 13 Aug 2011

Question, was it a 1996 Sandeman Vau Vintage or a 1997? I thought 1997 was the first release of it, though I very well could be mistaken.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by RonnieRoots » 16:59 Sat 13 Aug 2011

Andy Velebil wrote:Question, was it a 1996 Sandeman Vau Vintage or a 1997? I thought 1997 was the first release of it, though I very well could be mistaken.
Hi Andy, it was a 1996, which was the first release.

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by WS1 » 17:38 Sat 13 Aug 2011

Hi,

it was a splendid evening indeed! Since I left fairly early I was feeling OKish the next day. This was also very helpful since I had a very busy week ahead :cry: .
Hmm I cannot say it otherwise, our guessing/knowing port abilties were quite embarassing but nevertheless very educational and fun. I think my most embarrassing guess was the Croft da Roeda 1997 as Fonseca 1994 :? :roll: :lol:

As for all of you the tasting left a deep impression. Firstly I will continue to like Malvedos :) and will try to get more of the 1995. Since I have quite a bit of 1990 (standard bts) left I think this is now the right time to finish off the halves of Malvedos 1990 I have left. From Ben's comments I take he is interested to volunteer to help me in this task. :lol:

With regards to the ports of the 1991 vintage I was suprised how smooth and forward they already are. The Quinta de la Rosa was still a bit harsh. But overall already very drinkable. Based on various discussions we had on :tpf: and the impression Vargellas 91 left to me in our Vargellas vertical I did not expect this. Based on this tasting and having my "beige" or "money trousers" on (all 91 Ports are still very cheap compared to other vintages!) I would like to suggest to do a fairly complete (~30 ports) horicontal to find out whats what.
Delaforce 1992 left me stunned. Despite I like old Delaforce I am not so fond of the newer vintages. Really good. The Eira Velha was good but not exciting. Very compact, well structured port with good palate but short after taste.

Wine of the night for me as for most was Ramos Pinto 1994. Generally I like Ramos Pinto; they are always quality and can be sometimes picked up fairly cheap. I think this would also do well in a bigger 1994 VP tasting. Also following Christophers coments a wider "best of the best" 92/94/97 tasting should be organised. He is right ; we should follow up the current status. Despite fears quite a few are closed, I think it is worth doing.

The two ports from the 1997 vintage were very good indeed! I had quite a few times da Roeda 1997 before; but this was by far the best bt I tried so far. If the 1997s continue to evolve so positively based on the samples I had so far I fear they will rival the 1992s and some 1994s at one stage.

Overall for me the biggest revelation of the tasting was twofold:

1.) The quality of ports from the nineteennineties is generally a lot better than I thought. I like older port and have currently quite a few ports from the eighties for current drinking. Therefore I had the impression the ports from e.g. 1983 would give a good benchmark for port from the eighties. After this tasting I must say with few exceptions e.g. Fonseca 1985, Dow 1980, etc. you should not buy ports from this decade anymore. They are of the same or less quality but comand higher prices due to age than ports from the nineteennineties. And some of the nineteennineties ports drinking rather well already!!

2.) I felt throughout the tasting unsure about about the ports of this decade. Make no mistake I appreciated the quality but the feeling of being lost remained. For me this is easily explained; mostly I drink older ports (preferably of 1970! :wink: ) which I like and left wrongly "ealier maturing" vintages behind. Hence I would like to suggest we also start doing horicontals of younger vintages. We otherwise potentially miss something :?

regards

WS1
"Sometimes too much to drink is barely enough"
Mark Twain

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Re: Port from the Nineteen Nineties, Mon 08 August 2011

Post by Andy Velebil » 18:46 Sat 13 Aug 2011

RonnieRoots wrote:
Andy Velebil wrote:Question, was it a 1996 Sandeman Vau Vintage or a 1997? I thought 1997 was the first release of it, though I very well could be mistaken.
Hi Andy, it was a 1996, which was the first release.
Ah, thank you!

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