Port House abbreviations

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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 22:43 Mon 29 Aug 2016


PhilW
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by PhilW » 14:20 Tue 30 Aug 2016

jdaw1 wrote:Updated list:
List looks good to me.

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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 00:03 Wed 31 Aug 2016

Two added:
SJ = A Pinto dos Santos Júnior
Ud = O-Port-Unidade (precedent)

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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by Glenn E. » 23:49 Wed 31 Aug 2016

PhilW wrote:
jdaw1 wrote:Updated list:
List looks good to me.
And me.

Do we need an 'E' to fill out the alphabet?
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AHB
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by AHB » 20:55 Sat 03 Sep 2016

What about Real Vinicola?

(I'm happy with the proposed Fs for Feist.)
Top Ports in 2018 (so far): Niepoort VV (1960's Bottling), Quinta do Noval Nacional 1994 and San Leonardo Very Old White (Bottled 2018)
2017 Ports of the year: Fonseca 1927 and Quinta do Noval 1927

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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 15:25 Sun 04 Sep 2016

AHB wrote:What about Real Vinicola?
= RO?

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AHB
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by AHB » 19:41 Sun 04 Sep 2016

No, a different brand owned by the same company. The same only in the sense that Gould Campbell and Quarles Harris are the same. While the same wine could be used for the different labels, it was also equally possible that different juice was used.
Top Ports in 2018 (so far): Niepoort VV (1960's Bottling), Quinta do Noval Nacional 1994 and San Leonardo Very Old White (Bottled 2018)
2017 Ports of the year: Fonseca 1927 and Quinta do Noval 1927

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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 20:18 Sun 04 Sep 2016

RVi? RVc? Pee? RVo?


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AHB
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by AHB » 20:32 Sun 04 Sep 2016

What is the rule for a single letter abbreviation to be used for a shipper? Why no single letter abbreviation for shippers beginning with M?
Top Ports in 2018 (so far): Niepoort VV (1960's Bottling), Quinta do Noval Nacional 1994 and San Leonardo Very Old White (Bottled 2018)
2017 Ports of the year: Fonseca 1927 and Quinta do Noval 1927

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AHB
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by AHB » 20:33 Sun 04 Sep 2016

jdaw1 wrote:RVi? RVc? Pee? RVo?
RVi works for me
Top Ports in 2018 (so far): Niepoort VV (1960's Bottling), Quinta do Noval Nacional 1994 and San Leonardo Very Old White (Bottled 2018)
2017 Ports of the year: Fonseca 1927 and Quinta do Noval 1927

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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 20:40 Sun 04 Sep 2016

AHB wrote:What is the rule for a single letter abbreviation to be used for a shipper? Why no single letter abbreviation for shippers beginning with M?
Shippers are not equal. Taylor is a more important shipper that Tedo. As Taylor is the only ‘T’ with this property, Taylor gets a single letter. Likewise, Sandeman and Skeffington; Graham and Guedes; Fonseca and Feuerheerd; Dow and Dalva.

There are no important M shippers. None get the single-letter privilege.

The definition of ‘important’ is ‘as deemed by JDAW’.

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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 20:43 Sun 04 Sep 2016


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AHB
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by AHB » 22:19 Sun 04 Sep 2016

jdaw1 wrote:The definition of ‘important’ is ‘as deemed by JDAW’.
Burmester is historically more important to shippers beginning with B than Martinez is to shippers beginning with M. Discuss. (100 marks available.)
Top Ports in 2018 (so far): Niepoort VV (1960's Bottling), Quinta do Noval Nacional 1994 and San Leonardo Very Old White (Bottled 2018)
2017 Ports of the year: Fonseca 1927 and Quinta do Noval 1927

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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 22:21 Sun 04 Sep 2016

AHB wrote:
jdaw1 wrote:The definition of ‘important’ is ‘as deemed by JDAW’.
Burmester is historically more important to shippers beginning with B than Martinez is to shippers beginning with M. Discuss. (100 marks available.)
That’s fair. Martinez = M?

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AHB
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by AHB » 23:03 Sun 04 Sep 2016

Martinez = M has better brevity than Burmester = Bu.

Works for me.
Top Ports in 2018 (so far): Niepoort VV (1960's Bottling), Quinta do Noval Nacional 1994 and San Leonardo Very Old White (Bottled 2018)
2017 Ports of the year: Fonseca 1927 and Quinta do Noval 1927

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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 23:34 Sun 04 Sep 2016

It’s a substantial change of years-long practice. It needs more of a consensus than AHB enthusiasm and JDAW reluctant acceptance of change in a changing world. Others?

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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by Glenn E. » 18:29 Mon 05 Sep 2016

I am mostly ambivalent, but happy to accept our new M=Martinez overlords.
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by Glenn E. » 18:30 Mon 05 Sep 2016

Why not RV for Real Vinicola?
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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 18:32 Mon 05 Sep 2016

Glenn E. wrote:Why not RV for Real Vinicola?
jdaw1 wrote:RV = Rebello Valente

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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by PhilW » 19:18 Mon 05 Sep 2016

I'm less convinced by the idea of complete overhaul. I would stay with Mz, for example. For Real Vinicola while I'm OK with RVi, I would suggest an alternative not proposed of RVn, on the basis that we seem to have mostly select next/later consonant rather than vowels to date.

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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 19:34 Mon 05 Sep 2016

Martinez: Alex wants change. Glenn and I tolerate it. Phil opposes.

RVn: opinions?

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jdaw1
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by jdaw1 » 21:45 Mon 05 Sep 2016

Any objection to Ps = Quinta do Passadouro (whether or not made by Niepoort)?

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flash_uk
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by flash_uk » 23:11 Mon 05 Sep 2016

jdaw1 wrote:Martinez: Alex wants change. Glenn and I tolerate it. Phil opposes.

RVn: opinions?
I'm with Phil on the Martinez point. Just because M is free doesn't mean it must be used. When I read Mz I immediately recognise which shipper is being referenced. If I read M, I would need to think about it for a moment.

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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by Glenn E. » 04:55 Tue 06 Sep 2016

jdaw1 wrote:Any objection to Ps = Quinta do Passadouro (whether or not made by Niepoort)?
My familiarity with Passadouro ends basically with the name.

If it produced Port on its own, then Ps seems fine.

But when produced by Niepoort, it should be NiPs for those vintages.

I don't think Ps should be used for both.
Last edited by Glenn E. on 05:00 Tue 06 Sep 2016, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Port House abbreviations

Post by Glenn E. » 05:00 Tue 06 Sep 2016

PhilW wrote:I'm less convinced by the idea of complete overhaul. I would stay with Mz, for example. For Real Vinicola while I'm OK with RVi, I would suggest an alternative not proposed of RVn, on the basis that we seem to have mostly select next/later consonant rather than vowels to date.
I do understand the desire to keep what works, and am fine with Mz. I'm really only in favor of breaking with tradition when doing so provides additional clarity or better standardization. Mz -> M really does neither.

RVi and RVn are equally fine to me now that I've been reminded of RV.
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