On the hunt for a 93!

Anything to do with Port.
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JacobH
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by JacobH » 12:06 Wed 26 May 2021

Chris Doty wrote:
10:03 Mon 24 May 2021
My point, just to be clear, is

BRAND

Ports brand image hasn’t yet moved into broad consumption. It is regarded as a mans after dinner cigar drink. And even then it competes in a staggeringly diverse array of other men’s drinks

No one drinks those wines. Nor do they discuss them.

They talk about their preferences for flavored seltzer water and shandy and ... ?!
This is a general issue with any “special category” wine. People just don’t really drink them any more. Even somewhere really traditional like Rules—which still has Port and some pudding wines by the glass— offers cocktails and champagne as aperitifs rather than, say, sherry or Madeira. I can only think of couple of restaurants that offer, say, vermouth other than as a cocktail ingredient or some of the French fortifieds. I don’t think I’ve ever seen an Aussie or SA Port on offer.

At least with the natural wine movement people are a bit more receptive to some of the oxidised wines than they used to be but it just seems to me it is going to take a huge change before lots of people start wanting to drink things that table or sparkling wines.
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MigSU
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by MigSU » 12:06 Wed 26 May 2021

JacobH wrote:
11:51 Wed 26 May 2021
Since this thread is going in all sorts of directions

Fridge freezer for sale, £100 or best offer.
Last edited by MigSU on 12:11 Wed 26 May 2021, edited 1 time in total.

MigSU
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by MigSU » 12:08 Wed 26 May 2021

JacobH wrote:
12:06 Wed 26 May 2021
I don’t think I’ve ever seen an Aussie or SA Port on offer.
Good. :evil:

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JacobH
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by JacobH » 12:27 Wed 26 May 2021

MigSU wrote:
12:08 Wed 26 May 2021
Good. :evil:
Don’t forget that David Guimaraens spent quite a lot of time working with the Australians before he moved back to Portugal!
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by MigSU » 12:46 Wed 26 May 2021

JacobH wrote:
12:27 Wed 26 May 2021
MigSU wrote:
12:08 Wed 26 May 2021
Good. :evil:
Don’t forget that David Guimaraens spent quite a lot of time working with the Australians before he moved back to Portugal!
We all have our crosses to bear :D

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Doggett
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by Doggett » 12:53 Wed 26 May 2021

MigSU wrote:
12:08 Wed 26 May 2021
JacobH wrote:
12:06 Wed 26 May 2021
I don’t think I’ve ever seen an Aussie or SA Port on offer.
Good. :evil:
Quite often available through Laithwaites is the basic 10YO Penfolds Tawny wine. And through other merchants the Grandfather Tawny and Great grandfather editions which are quite pricey. There are plenty of other examples if you search them out.

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JacobH
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by JacobH » 13:06 Wed 26 May 2021

Doggett wrote:
12:53 Wed 26 May 2021
Quite often available through Laithwaites is the basic 10YO Penfolds Tawny wine. And through other merchants the Grandfather Tawny and Great grandfather editions which are quite pricey. There are plenty of other examples if you search them out.
Yes. I was thinking more that whilst they are available they tend to be only available from specialist suppliers or the online places that are quite big. I don’t think I’ve ever seen them in a bar or restaurant. For example, the South African restaurant in Farrington, Vivat Bacchus is very wine-focused but has two Ports, a sherry, a Banyuls, a Tokaji and a SA Riesling for sale by the glass. They don’t even have a SA fortified by the bottle on their big list of SA wines.
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Alex Bridgeman
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by Alex Bridgeman » 23:21 Wed 26 May 2021

JacobH wrote:
12:06 Wed 26 May 2021
Chris Doty wrote:
10:03 Mon 24 May 2021
My point, just to be clear, is

BRAND

Ports brand image hasn’t yet moved into broad consumption. It is regarded as a mans after dinner cigar drink. And even then it competes in a staggeringly diverse array of other men’s drinks

No one drinks those wines. Nor do they discuss them.

They talk about their preferences for flavored seltzer water and shandy and ... ?!
This is a general issue with any “special category” wine. People just don’t really drink them any more. Even somewhere really traditional like Rules—which still has Port and some pudding wines by the glass— offers cocktails and champagne as aperitifs rather than, say, sherry or Madeira. I can only think of couple of restaurants that offer, say, vermouth other than as a cocktail ingredient or some of the French fortifieds. I don’t think I’ve ever seen an Aussie or SA Port on offer.

At least with the natural wine movement people are a bit more receptive to some of the oxidised wines than they used to be but it just seems to me it is going to take a huge change before lots of people start wanting to drink things that table or sparkling wines.
In the good old days, CMAG and I would occasionally lunch at Ibérica on Victoria Street. I would inevitably arrive before him and thoroughly enjoyed their range of about 5-6 different Vermouths available by the glass.
Top Ports in 2019: Niepoort VV (1960s bottling) and Quinta do Noval Nacional 2017
Top Ports in 2020 (so far): Croft 1945 and Niepoort VV (1960s bottling)

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Alex Bridgeman
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by Alex Bridgeman » 23:32 Wed 26 May 2021

I’ve also just realised that I have a bottle of Stanton & Killeen’s 1993 Vintage Fortified (which is what they now call their Port-style fortified wine).
Top Ports in 2019: Niepoort VV (1960s bottling) and Quinta do Noval Nacional 2017
Top Ports in 2020 (so far): Croft 1945 and Niepoort VV (1960s bottling)

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JacobH
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by JacobH » 09:47 Thu 27 May 2021

Alex Bridgeman wrote:
23:21 Wed 26 May 2021
In the good old days, CMAG and I would occasionally lunch at Ibérica on Victoria Street. I would inevitably arrive before him and thoroughly enjoyed their range of about 5-6 different Vermouths available by the glass.
That’s interesting. Vermouth seems to have a huge popularity in Spain: the last time I was in Madrid a couple of years ago there were all sorts of places specialising it (including on tap!). I think the best vermouth range in London is Mele e Pere in Soho. They make some themselves and also have a huge list by the glass.
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akzy
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by akzy » 16:16 Thu 27 May 2021

Now definitely not Port - please demote.
JacobH wrote:
11:51 Wed 26 May 2021
Since this thread is going in all sorts of directions, I hope that no-one will mind if I say this: I’m always intrigued by Tokaji Essencia since I have never quite understood who the target market is. I am not quite sure if the business of serving it on a tea-spoon is merely a marketing trick but at <3% ABV and up to 85% residual sugar ( :shock: ) I presume that most people don’t drink more than a very small amount in one go.

Does it ever get drunk other than as a novelty? I assume it must do, but I can’t quite work out who by and when!

Fortunately this is the Aszu Essencia so is 7.5% - basically special brew 88) .

It's surely just the same market as Sauternes - pairs with the same stuff?

MigSU
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by MigSU » 16:32 Thu 27 May 2021

Like a nice fatty foie.

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JacobH
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by JacobH » 17:40 Thu 27 May 2021

akzy wrote:
16:16 Thu 27 May 2021
Fortunately this is the Aszu Essencia so is 7.5% - basically special brew 88) .

It's surely just the same market as Sauternes - pairs with the same stuff?
Ah. Thank you. I wasn’t aware that there was a difference between “Aszu Essencia” and “Essencia”. At those sorts of ABV / sugar levels I’m sure it is very enjoyable on its own!
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Alex Bridgeman
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by Alex Bridgeman » 15:18 Sun 27 Jun 2021

I had a very decent bottle of Le Haut Lieu Moelleux 1993 Vouvray on Friday night. Could be another wine for the ‘93 children to look out for (I paid £43 for the bottle).
Top Ports in 2019: Niepoort VV (1960s bottling) and Quinta do Noval Nacional 2017
Top Ports in 2020 (so far): Croft 1945 and Niepoort VV (1960s bottling)

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uncle tom
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Re: On the hunt for a 93!

Post by uncle tom » 17:16 Sun 27 Jun 2021

Could be another wine for the ‘93 children to look out for
Aside from a bottle of Licieras and some Crasto LBV, I notice that I also have a Taylor 10yr - bottled in '93
I may be drunk, Miss, but in the morning I shall be sober and you will still be ugly - W.S. Churchill

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