Time for a TN sort?

[Alex Bridgeman]

This is a bit of a problem. Essentially, if someone posts ‟Sandeman Ruby (bottled 2010)” then, I agree, it might make sense for it to be listed without a date, rather than with one. However, if someone posts ‟Sandeman Ruby (bottled 1910)” then there is a strong argument that that should be listed with its date, since it’s the date that makes it interesting. Also a review of a 1910 Ruby is not going to be of much use to someone looking for notes on a recently purchased bottle.

I suppose, as a compromise, I could kill the bottling dates if they are more recent, so only those which have a significant time in the bottle appear. Looking at what we have at the moment, there aren’t any non-vintage Ports with bottling dates in the 1990s, 2000 or 2001 on the list, so we could start killing the dates from 2002 onwards, or have it on a rolling basis starting a decade ago.

I hadn't realised it was deliberate placement, in which case I am happy.

However, to pick up on the points you have raised, perhaps one way to keep people happy would be to sub-categorise the NV heading. In other words, you could have:
NV
Sandeman 20 year old tawny
Bottled 2002
Bottled 2003
Bottled 2004
etc.

That way, if someone has tasted an old bottling (such as the 3* Sandeman Ruby that was estimated to have been bottled in the 1930s that Derek opened a few years ago), people can find it easily - just look up Sandeman Ruby. But the primary location would be NV port - since that's what it is.

The suggestion that I have made could also be applied to colheitas which have multiple bottling dates.
1978
Niepoort colheita
Bottled 1985
Bottled 1996
Bottled 2008

Or am I now making too much work? (In which case, put my idea in the "good idea, but impractical" basket.)

[JacobH]

My previous laptop died a little while ago and I am currently borrowing a MacBook, which doesn’t have the various pieces of software on it to generate the index. Therefore, apologies for the hiatus in updating. I’ll try to update it again once my new one arrives in the next couple of weeks.

[Alex Bridgeman]

Any chance of a tasting note update please?

[Alex Bridgeman]

I'm now up to date with my tasting notes. Is there any chance of an update to the TN index?

[JacobH]

Yes. I am afraid there are two problems. Firstly, I have been hopeless. Secondly, I lost the most recent version of the code. I do have a backup but it will require some work. I am starting on the process now.

Considering my incompetence, it strikes me I need to work on automating the system. But one stage at a time.

[jdaw1]

Jacob, welcome back.

[JacobH]

Thank you. I now have most of the code working, including some improvements to make it more automatic.

[Alex Bridgeman]

Did we get a TN sort organised?

[DRT]

Did we get a TN sort organised?

Unfortunately not. We need a new plan.

[DRT]

A new plan has been hatched but it will take a while before someone much more clever than I can implement it.

As the existing index had not been updated for 13 months I have replaced it with a very basic temporary listing which can easily be kept up to date until the new Tasting Note Magnetron Accelerator is ready for launch.

As you will see when you view the index there are a number of formatting issues with some of the thread descriptions. I will attempt to resolve those over the coming weeks.

Your continued patience is appreciated.

[DRT]

Your attention is drawn to the new version of the TN Title Format guidelines.

[DRT]

a very basic temporary listing which can easily be kept up to date until the new Tasting Note Magnetron Accelerator is ready for launch.

Slightly better presentation of the temporary solution has now been implemented.

[DRT]

Could those people who use the Tasting Note section please take a look at the new tasting note index and provide feedback here as to whether or not it meets your needs?

Given the numerous issues we have had with maintaining more complex versions of the index in the past I am very keen to keep things as simple as possible this time whilst still wanting to provide an index which is fit for purpose. The index that exists today can be updated in approximately 10 minutes with very little work and no trickery. However it does require strict application of the new TN Title Format to ensure entries end up at least roughly in the correct place in the index. I am happy to put in the work to keep the thread title data clean provided the index gives you what you need.

Thanks
Derek

[DRT]

Lots of cleaning up of the code tonight thanks to help from jdaw1.

[DRT]

The tasting note index now has a search function.

Please give it a go and report any issues here.

[djewesbury]

The tasting note index now has a search function.

Please give it a go and report any issues here.

Very nice! Is the index fully self-updating now?

[Alex Bridgeman]

Nice approach and great to have an updated TN listing. I have a couple of requests of which one should be easy and one I have no idea whether it is easy or not:

(1) Could you please put a key at the top of the page as to what the daggers and double daggers represent.
(2) When you do a search (eg on the shipper Ferreira), is it easy to have the results shown in vintage date order? If so, could this be done?

Thanks.

[DRT]

The tasting note index now has a search function.

Please give it a go and report any issues here.

Very nice! Is the index fully self-updating now?

The search function goes directly to the database so will always be up to date. The listing on the index page needs to be updated manually, but takes about 2 minutes to do.

[DRT]

(1) Could you please put a key at the top of the page as to what the daggers and double daggers represent.

Will do. There was a debate about whether or not these were sufficiently intuitive. You have answered the question

(2) When you do a search (eg on the shipper Ferreira), is it easy to have the results shown in vintage date order? If so, could this be done?

This is more difficult, and perhaps impossible. The search function passes the input values into a standard phpBB forum "Advanced search" function with some of the advanced settings pre-selected. By default phpBB displays forum postings in reverse chronological order using the date of the last post in each thread. I do not know how to alter that behaviour. Perhaps this is a good reason to have both the search option and the static listing?

Thanks to you and djewesbury for the feedback and suggestions.

[benread]

The tasting note index now has a search function.

Please give it a go and report any issues here.

Brilliant! Does exactly what I want and I love the fact I can also search within the results.

[DRT]

Brilliant! Does exactly what I want and I love the fact I can also search within the results.

Thanks, Ben. You will have to thank the guys at phpBB for the search within a search as that is simply part of the standard software. All I did was get you to the right page to be able to use it

[DRT]

Interestingly, phpBB searches don't seem to be fans of Dow. When you search for a vintage + "Dow" using either the new TN Index search or the standard advanced search in the forum it returns every TN from the vintage, not just Dow. Perhaps it likes at least four letters to perform an accurate search?

For those interested, the parameters used in the advanced search to have TNs displayed as they are when you search through the new TN Index function are:

• Search for keywords: Search for all terms or use query as entered;
• Search in forums: Port tasting notes;
• Search within: Topic titles only;
• Display results as: Topics;
• Return first: 0 characters of posts.

[DRT]

Added:

Tip: You can enter Tawny, Ruby, Reserve, Crusted, Garrafeira etc. in the vintage field to search for non-vintage ports.

[djewesbury]

The tasting note index now has a search function.

Please give it a go and report any issues here.

Brilliant! Does exactly what I want and I love the fact I can also search within the results.

+1.
The question of it ordering results by post date rather than vintage hadn't struck me, as I would generally search for a particular wine of a particular year (perhaps before standing it up in the cellar). I wouldn't expend too much energy finding a way to make it produce these vintage-ordered results just for the occasional port wonk who wants to see every tasting note for Constantino...!

[Alex Bridgeman]

(1) Could you please put a key at the top of the page as to what the daggers and double daggers represent.

Will do. There was a debate about whether or not these were sufficiently intuitive. You have answered the question

I have never claimed to be intuitive - and I still don't know what these represent!

(2) When you do a search (eg on the shipper Ferreira), is it easy to have the results shown in vintage date order? If so, could this be done?

This is more difficult, and perhaps impossible. The search function passes the input values into a standard phpBB forum "Advanced search" function with some of the advanced settings pre-selected. By default phpBB displays forum postings in reverse chronological order using the date of the last post in each thread. I do not know how to alter that behaviour. Perhaps this is a good reason to have both the search option and the static listing?

Perhaps there could be a shipper ordered static listing? I have no idea how phpBB code works, but perhaps you can chop the first 5 (year) or 3 (NV) characters from the titles and stitch them back at the end of the title and then create the listing from that?

[djewesbury]

I have never claimed to be intuitive - and I still don't know what these represent!

They are actually up arrows. One arrow to scroll up a little, two to return to the top of the page....

[Alex Bridgeman]

I have never claimed to be intuitive - and I still don't know what these represent!

They are actually up arrows. One arrow to scroll up a little, two to return to the top of the page....

So what's wrong with using the up or down key on the keyboard, home, end, page up and page down? That's a darn sight easier than using a trackpad to move a cursor over a tiny symbol on a page. <<grumpyoldman icon>>

[benread]

I have never claimed to be intuitive - and I still don't know what these represent!

They are actually up arrows. One arrow to scroll up a little, two to return to the top of the page....

So what's wrong with using the up or down key on the keyboard, home, end, page up and page down? That's a darn sight easier than using a trackpad to move a cursor over a tiny symbol on a page. <<grumpyoldman icon>>

Do you qualify as old yet?!

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD

[djewesbury]

I have never claimed to be intuitive - and I still don't know what these represent!

They are actually up arrows. One arrow to scroll up a little, two to return to the top of the page....

So what's wrong with using the up or down key on the keyboard, home, end, page up and page down? That's a darn sight easier than using a trackpad to move a cursor over a tiny symbol on a page. <<grumpyoldman icon>>

But you still can! This is just an added feature for the people still able to negotiate tiny symbols!!

[Alex Bridgeman]

But you still can! This is just an added feature for the people still able to negotiate tiny symbols!!

And I bet they don't need reading glasses yet <<doublegrumpyoldman icon>>

[Alex Bridgeman]

Do you qualify as old yet?!

Not in my mind, but I am proud to be a grumpy old man - that is a state of mind and not a state of age

[DRT]

Perhaps there could be a shipper ordered static listing?

If you stop moaning about the arrows I will build an alphabetical listing this weekend

[DRT]

Perhaps there could be a shipper ordered static listing?

If you stop moaning about the arrows I will build an alphabetical listing this weekend

The alphabetically sorted TN Index is now available.

[Glenn E.]

Perhaps there could be a shipper ordered static listing?

If you stop moaning about the arrows I will build an alphabetical listing this weekend

The alphabetically sorted TN Index is now available.

[Alex Bridgeman]

Perhaps there could be a shipper ordered static listing?

If you stop moaning about the arrows I will build an alphabetical listing this weekend

The alphabetically sorted TN Index is now available.

Absolutely fabulous - and made me realise I need to post my 2011 tasting notes as separate tasting notes. Thanks for this, it's brilliant.

[DRT]

Perhaps there could be a shipper ordered static listing?

If you stop moaning about the arrows I will build an alphabetical listing this weekend

The alphabetically sorted TN Index is now available.

Absolutely fabulous - and made me realise I need to post my 2011 tasting notes as separate tasting notes. Thanks for this, it's brilliant.

[DRT]

Now that the Port TN indices are working I plan to create an index for the "Other Wines" section of the forum.

As there are only a few hundred TNs in that are at the moment the method of sorting can be more flexible than that of the Port TNs as I could do some of it manually.

What would be the most useful method of sorting?

I am thinking it could be split by Region > Vintage (or NV) > Producer so that we would have all the Claret, Douro wines, Champagne, etc listed individually as separate blocks.

Would that be useful?

[jdaw1]

In practice, any list of names in one page will allow ⌘F to do the work.

[jdaw1]

Please could the Vintage and Alphabetical indexes link to each other?

[DRT]

Now that the Port TN indices are working I plan to create an index for the "Other Wines" section of the forum.

Two minutes after posting this I realised how easy it would be to do this. Do we need anything more complicated than that for a section of the forum with only five pages of posts to scan through?

[DRT]

In practice, any list of names in one page will allow ⌘F to do the work.

As we don't want to have a reputation for sectarianism can you please also post the Windows alternative to that Mac OS function?

[DRT]

Please could the Vintage and Alphabetical indexes link to each other?

Someone just pointed out to me that I have other chores to attend to but I will do this when time permits.

[DRT]

Please could the Vintage and Alphabetical indexes link to each other?

Someone just pointed out to me that I have other chores to attend to but I will do this when time permits.

Done. I had to do a forced re-load of each of the pages to see the change. I'm not sure if there is a way of forcing that from within the code so anyone who knows please tell me how.

[DRT]

I need to post my 2011 tasting notes as separate tasting notes.

AHB has now posted all of his 2011 TNs and the index has been updated.

[djewesbury]

I need to post my 2011 tasting notes as separate tasting notes.

AHB has now posted all of his 2011 TNs and the index has been updated.

[DRT]

I need to post my 2011 tasting notes as separate tasting notes.

AHB has now posted all of his 2011 TNs and the index has been updated.

AHB posted more 2011 TNs and has also been doing some cleaning up of TN names to assist in sorting within the index so I have updated the index pages again.

Thank you AHB for your sacrifices for the team.

[DRT]

AHB's work in cleaning up the TN thread titles is now complete. Thank you AHB!!

You might notice a few compromises that we have applied in order to place some Ports in a logical sequence. The principle example being that we have named all Noval Ports with the prefix "Quinta do" even though (for good reason) some of their products do not bear those words on the label. Were there pedants amongst us we might have worried that this would cause discomfort but AHB and I agreed that there are no pedants here so all should be ok.

[jdaw1]

but AHB and I agreed that there are no pedants here so all should be ok.

{Look to the left. Looks to the right.} All clear captain.

[djewesbury]

I just noticed a funny inconsistency; on the alphabetical and date-sorted TN pages, the logo at the top left is not a link to the index page. On every other forum page it is.

[DRT]

For me, on every page including the index pages the logo does not link to anything but the words ThePortForum.com do.

I am confused by your comment