Christie’s auctions

Post by **jdaw1** » 17:29 Sat 03 Jan 2015

Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 6 November 1975.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #23872.)

I wonder what management flaws caused Morgan Steel to go bust?

djewesbury · Post by **djewesbury** » 17:34 Sat 03 Jan 2015

jdaw1 wrote:I wonder what management flaws caused Morgan Steel to go bust?

Are you hinting that there is an interesting story here, or genuinely wondering?

Post by **jdaw1** » 17:39 Sat 03 Jan 2015

djewesbury wrote:Are you hinting that there is an interesting story here, or genuinely wondering?

It was the sort of steel company that had bought 100 dozen of ’63 Port. How many other core skills did they have, I wonder.

djewesbury · Post by **djewesbury** » 17:41 Sat 03 Jan 2015

jdaw1 wrote:
djewesbury wrote:Are you hinting that there is an interesting story here, or genuinely wondering?
It was the sort of steel company that had bought 100 dozen of ’63 Port.

But it was only Gonzalez-Byass. Sounds very restrained to me.

Post by **jdaw1** » 23:28 Sat 03 Jan 2015

jdaw1 wrote:It was the sort of steel company that had bought 100 dozen of ’63 Port.

I apologise for slanderously under-estimating Morgan Steel & Co. Ltd.

From the same auction by Christie, Manson & Woods, on 6 November 1975, lots 381 to 389 comprised another 39 dozen of the same, except duty paid, and sold at £19 and £19.50 per dozen.

Post by **jdaw1** » 12:10 Sun 04 Jan 2015

[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=86527#p86527]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 12 February 1976.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #23927.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 15:31 Sun 04 Jan 2015

Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 17 June 1976.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #23978.)
One hundred dozen Fonseca 1970 sold at £30 per dozen.

Post by **jdaw1** » 15:42 Sun 04 Jan 2015

Christie, Manson & Woods, 1 June 1976.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my pictures #23991.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 20:52 Sun 04 Jan 2015

Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 11 November 1976 (and previous auctions).

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24050.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 21:18 Sun 04 Jan 2015

Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 11 November 1976, lots 413 to 415 (obscured by weight)

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24073.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 21:56 Sun 04 Jan 2015

Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 11 November 1976.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24078.)

Oh, prices? You want to know what they cost? You don’t. Really, you don’t.

Behold, and weep!

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24092.)

Post by **PhilW** » 08:54 Mon 05 Jan 2015

jdaw1 wrote:One hundred dozen Fonseca 1970 sold at £30 per dozen.

Andy Velebil · Post by **Andy Velebil** » 13:44 Mon 05 Jan 2015

someone please invent a time machine!

Post by **jdaw1** » 16:52 Mon 05 Jan 2015

Nowadays they don’t do this.

Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 5 April 1977.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24167.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 18:23 Mon 05 Jan 2015

Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 30 June 1977.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24201.)

Strange.

Post by **jdaw1** » 21:05 Mon 05 Jan 2015

Christie, Manson & Woods, 2 June 1977.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24229.)

Post by **flash_uk** » 21:13 Mon 05 Jan 2015

These memos are fascinating. Thank you for unearthing them and sharing them.

Post by **jdaw1** » 21:16 Mon 05 Jan 2015

[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=86730#p86730]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 14 July 1977.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24234.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 22:21 Mon 05 Jan 2015

[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=86737#p86737]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 13 September 1977.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24251.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 00:17 Tue 06 Jan 2015

[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=86740#p86740]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 6 December 1977.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24339.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 00:22 Tue 06 Jan 2015

That means that I have typed all the Christie’s data I have, which is for auctions ≤1977. There will be one more day of photographing, partly to retake some imperfectly taken the first time (oops!), and partly to get to auctions in the nineteen eighties.

And that, I declare, will be enough data. Or too much.

Post by **jdaw1** » 23:44 Mon 12 Jan 2015

Auction, Christie, Manson & Woods, 19 March 1868.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #18217.)

Post by **DRT** » 00:00 Tue 13 Jan 2015

So small it hardly seems worthwhile bidding

Post by **jdaw1** » 10:18 Wed 14 Jan 2015

[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=87103#p87103]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:Auction, Christie’s, 14 February 1978.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24508.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 15:08 Wed 14 Jan 2015

[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=87110#p87110]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:Auction, Christie’s, 30 March 1978.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24516.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 22:35 Thu 15 Jan 2015

[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=87247#p87247]Here[/url] jdaw1 wrote:Auction, Christie’s, 29 June 1978.

Sold at £35 per dozen.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24566.)

Post by **jdaw1** » 22:44 Sun 18 Jan 2015

Auction, Christie’s, 20 July 1978.

(Reproduced by kind permission of Christie’s; my picture #24589.)

The handwriting is unclear: the sale price is £210.

Andy Velebil · Post by **Andy Velebil** » 23:01 Sun 18 Jan 2015

Well now don't that throw a monkey wrench in things. Lol

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Post by **jdaw1** » 23:06 Sun 18 Jan 2015

I particularly liked the “Rare”.

At Andy Velebil’s request, this also posted on

.

Post by **DRT** » 23:48 Sun 18 Jan 2015

Splendid. In one week we have discovered that Noval produced Nacional prior to 1931 and that Fonseca Guimaraens produced two 1931s.

Should we organise a tasting?

uncle tom · Post by **uncle tom** » 08:40 Mon 19 Jan 2015

There was a Noval '27, but IIRC, the Nacional vineyard was planted in 1926..

A wine made from 1 year old vines on very poor soil? - I have my doubts...

djewesbury · Post by **djewesbury** » 12:34 Mon 19 Jan 2015

I thought the planting was 1925 but yes, same point as Tom.

Andy Velebil · Post by **Andy Velebil** » 14:02 Mon 19 Jan 2015

uncle tom wrote:There was a Noval '27, but IIRC, the Nacional vineyard was planted in 1926..

A wine made from 1 year old vines on very poor soil? - I have my doubts...

But there are no records to say definitively how it was replanted. Was it all replanted at one time, or was part of it replanted a little at a time? And doesn't anyone else find it odd that someone in 1925 decided this little plot of land was the perfect place to plant ungrafted vines? I suspect there were ungrafted vines there all along and this was an early "trial" version of Nacional.

On a side, I've learned never to say never in the Douro. Everyone was "the first" to do this or that, wines that don't exists do, seemingly everyone bought and sold from everyone else at some point in history, and record keeping wasn't their strong suit. So for something like this to happen doesn't surprise me

djewesbury · Post by **djewesbury** » 15:32 Mon 19 Jan 2015

Andy Velebil wrote:I suspect there were ungrafted vines there all along and this was an early "trial" version of Nacional.

I think this sounds very likely.

Andy Velebil wrote:record keeping wasn't their strong suit

As a further aside, I think that the English-speaking world gets less than half the story; I would say that

and

are the exceptions, because the source of much of the information quoted here is 'the horse's mouth', so to speak. But I've read so many books and articles about Port and its convoluted history that depend on the English records alone, which are obviously partial (in both senses of the word, at different times). There's a lot published / written / archived in Portuguese that we never get to read about.

Post by **jdaw1** » 16:16 Mon 19 Jan 2015

djewesbury wrote:There's a lot published / written / archived in Portuguese that

… was subsequently destroyed in an insurance fire.

djewesbury · Post by **djewesbury** » 16:17 Mon 19 Jan 2015

Yes, in this instance. I was arguing the more general point, as I said.

Post by **jdaw1** » 22:56 Fri 26 Feb 2016

Auction, by Messrs. Christie, Manson & Woods, on 12 April 1937, “Rare Wines & Liqueurs, Generously presented for Sale for the Benefit of The Funds of Queen Charlotte’s Hospital”.

Sold at 50/- (=£2½) and 60/- (=£3) per dozen. Yes, lots 116 and 117 each hammered at £1¼. VFM-tastic.

Post by **Alex Bridgeman** » 14:25 Sat 27 Feb 2016

jdaw1 wrote:Auction, by Messrs. Christie, Manson & Woods, on 12 April 1937, “Rare Wines & Liqueurs, Generously presented for Sale for the Benefit of The Funds of Queen Charlotte’s Hospital”.

Sold at 50/- (=£2½) and 60/- (=£3) per dozen. Yes, lots 116 and 117 each hammered at £1¼. VFM-tastic.

Over the years I've drunk the former and seen the latter. I wonder if the bottles that I've encountered came from this sale. What an interesting circle of history, but I guess that I will never be able to know for sure.

Post by **Alex Bridgeman** » 22:21 Sat 27 Feb 2016

AHB wrote:
jdaw1 wrote:Auction, by Messrs. Christie, Manson & Woods, on 12 April 1937, “Rare Wines & Liqueurs, Generously presented for Sale for the Benefit of The Funds of Queen Charlotte’s Hospital”.

Sold at 50/- (=£2½) and 60/- (=£3) per dozen. Yes, lots 116 and 117 each hammered at £1¼. VFM-tastic.
Over the years I've drunk the former and seen the latter. I wonder if the bottles that I've encountered came from this sale. What an interesting circle of history, but I guess that I will never be able to know for sure.

Just found my notes, in which I estimate that the 1863 was probably bottled around 1890 (based on the bottle), so the comment in the catalogue about the wine being bottled over 50 years prior to the sale is pretty consistent with this estimate.

Post by **jdaw1** » 23:08 Wed 01 Jun 2016

Did that shipper ever own that vineyard? Evidence of same welcomed.

Post by **DRT** » 06:58 Thu 02 Jun 2016

jdaw1 wrote:
Did that shipper ever own that vineyard? Evidence of same welcomed.

[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3267&p=30822#p30822]Here[/url] Dom Symington wrote:Zimbro was sold to the Pinto Espanyol's by my family in 1952. We continue to make the Port from the property although they have recently started to make some Douro DOC's from Zimbro as well. (at the time the sale of Zimbro & Sra. da Ribeira enabled the family to remain independent)
RoncÃ£o was as you correctly mention a Robertson property who's vintage brand is Rabelo Valente. Robertson's were acquired by Sandeman's shortly after the war. It is now privately owned and may well supply Noval being virtually "off the back" of the Quinta.
Feurheerd were based at Quinta de la Rosa however Clare Feureheerd (married Bergqvist, Sophia's grand-mother) inherited the property privately, hence the change.
In the post-war years many shippers simply closed or merged into some of the larger companies. At the time both Ferreira and Barros acquired quite a number and now periodically release them as a brand or just a vintage.
Bom Retiro is the name used for the general area of the Rio Torto valley with a number of properties using the name or a variation of... The actual Bom Retiro Quinta, a larger part (approx 60%) belongs to Ramos Pinto while a smaller part (approx. 40%) belonged to the SerÃ´dio family and it has been an integral part of Warre's vintage since 1932 and was purchased from the SerÃ´dio heirs by my family a couple of years ago. (3 SerÃ´dio's have or currently still work with my family and one of the next generation has just joined us!)

The period in question is just after phyloxera when many shippers were looking to buy properties in the Douro. It must be remembered that shippers at this time were effectively brokers buying wines from growers, aging, blending and exporting as required and it is more than likely that they would have found/selected specific lots of exceptional wines and offered them as Single Quinta. After all Kopke's Qta. de Roriz was probably the most famous Vintage Port in the mid C.19! ... incidentaly in the late C.19 Kopke was managed by George Hardy Mason, Maurice Symington's (my Grandfather) father-in-law.

It's not easy to use todays Quinta ownership as the basis for late C.19 wines. Additionally the Douro was very much foucused further west than it is today therefore some peoprtires may not even feature in today's records... I'm not sure if this helps...!
Dom Symington

Andy Velebil · Post by **Andy Velebil** » 23:15 Thu 02 Jun 2016

DRT wrote:
jdaw1 wrote:
Did that shipper ever own that vineyard? Evidence of same welcomed.
[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3267&p=30822#p30822]Here[/url] Dom Symington wrote:Zimbro was sold to the Pinto Espanyol's by my family in 1952. We continue to make the Port from the property although they have recently started to make some Douro DOC's from Zimbro as well. (at the time the sale of Zimbro & Sra. da Ribeira enabled the family to remain independent)
RoncÃ£o was as you correctly mention a Robertson property who's vintage brand is Rabelo Valente. Robertson's were acquired by Sandeman's shortly after the war. It is now privately owned and may well supply Noval being virtually "off the back" of the Quinta.
Feurheerd were based at Quinta de la Rosa however Clare Feureheerd (married Bergqvist, Sophia's grand-mother) inherited the property privately, hence the change.
In the post-war years many shippers simply closed or merged into some of the larger companies. At the time both Ferreira and Barros acquired quite a number and now periodically release them as a brand or just a vintage.
Bom Retiro is the name used for the general area of the Rio Torto valley with a number of properties using the name or a variation of... The actual Bom Retiro Quinta, a larger part (approx 60%) belongs to Ramos Pinto while a smaller part (approx. 40%) belonged to the SerÃ´dio family and it has been an integral part of Warre's vintage since 1932 and was purchased from the SerÃ´dio heirs by my family a couple of years ago. (3 SerÃ´dio's have or currently still work with my family and one of the next generation has just joined us!)

The period in question is just after phyloxera when many shippers were looking to buy properties in the Douro. It must be remembered that shippers at this time were effectively brokers buying wines from growers, aging, blending and exporting as required and it is more than likely that they would have found/selected specific lots of exceptional wines and offered them as Single Quinta. After all Kopke's Qta. de Roriz was probably the most famous Vintage Port in the mid C.19! ... incidentaly in the late C.19 Kopke was managed by George Hardy Mason, Maurice Symington's (my Grandfather) father-in-law.

It's not easy to use todays Quinta ownership as the basis for late C.19 wines. Additionally the Douro was very much foucused further west than it is today therefore some peoprtires may not even feature in today's records... I'm not sure if this helps...!
Dom Symington

Who said the Douro's history was easy

Chris Doty · Post by **Chris Doty** » 23:56 Wed 12 May 2021

Where else but