ThePortForum.com

Andy

Thanks for the link. I wonder how much one of those box + test tubes (empty) would sell for on ebay...

Alex

**puts on conspiracy-theory hat**

Has anyone else noticed that the Scion label describes the wine as being a "Very Old Port"? The IVDP regulations specify that a designation of "very old" is to be reserved for a 40-year-old tawny. I wonder whether that implies there has been quite a bit of "refreshing" of this Port over the years?

Ah, but the category is "more than 40 years old" not just 40 years old. I do believe that 155 years old also qualifies as more than 40 years old.

Glenn E. wrote:Ah, but the category is "more than 40 years old" not just 40 years old. I do believe that 155 years old also qualifies as more than 40 years old.

I’m sure, though, that those buying this Port would prefer it to be a 155-year-old Colheita rather than a blended wine which tastes as if it is at least 40 years old...

It was a very good Port. I am not sure why folks here are doubting the claims of TFP. Would they risk their centuries old reputation with the chance of a scandal if this was to be proved false. I think not. Having one of those empty test tubes and boxes ... I can attest that the wine was in great condition.

Roy Hersh wrote:I am not sure why folks here are doubting the claims of TFP. Would they risk their centuries old reputation with the chance of a scandal if this was to be proved false. I think not.

Roy, my previous posts were made with my tongue firmly in my cheek

What interests me about this wine is where it comes from and how Taylor’s knows it to be that old. The first is, because, as a Port fan, I want to know which Quinta produced these hugely long-lasting Ports. For the second question, as I posted earlier:

JacobH wrote:My view is this: this is an unusual wine, which is being sold at vast cost on the basis of its great age. Taylor’s would not be so foolish to be marketing this if they were not highly confidence of its provenance. If they got it wrong, and were found out, it would be disastrous for the brand and kill of any ability for it to sell other products in the ultra-premium market (which I’m sure they would dearly love to populate). I am therefore just curious on what basis they have decided this is from 1855.
[...]
The evidence that Taylor’s have for the age of this may be simple and prosaic. There may be good records of this cellar’s stocks. Many of us were fortunate enough to see some of the old records from Vesuvio at the Vesuvio tasting earlier this year. However, just because of the unusual back-story to this, I would be interested to know what the evidence is.

I would also add to this, having just read AHB’s copy of ‟The Billionaires’ Vinegar” over Christmas, that I think it is best practice when a mysterious ancient wine is found to give its full provenance, pour encourager les autres if nothing else.

Agreed. The possibility certainly exists, that it just may not be known, although you'd think that the people who owned the pipes would have known more about them ... depending on "how" they were discovered. Although the Scion is old, it is not the oldest example of Colheita being found accidentally sitting in the Douro and then being bottled unblended. Many have tried the "infamous" 1853, two years older than Scion.

With that said, I believe it is not all that difficult for Colheita to remain in cask for as long as the Scion has and still be great. In 2009, I had "cask samples" of 1896 White Colheita, 1896 Colheita, followed by an 1863 Colheita ... all of which were mind blowing experiences AND directly from the casks to my glass. None of the three had EVER been bottled, nor sold.

I also brought to the UK, a bottle of 1906 Colheita which had been bottled the week before, for me to open with UK friends from this Forum. Sadly it did not show well initially, the day after flying from Portugal with that bottle. Later in the week when tasted again and over a half month later, back at home ... it turned into a stunning Port. I was just disappointed that when it was first opened, it was in a weird phase, possibly from just having been bottled and maybe even "bottle shock" from the plane ride. Not sure which.

Roy Hersh wrote:Agreed. The possibility certainly exists, that it just may not be known, although you'd think that the people who owned the pipes would have known more about them ... depending on "how" they were discovered. Although the Scion is old, it is not the oldest example of Colheita being found accidentally sitting in the Douro and then being bottled unblended. Many have tried the "infamous" 1853, two years older than Scion.

I'm sure that a lot is known about these pipes which is not being mentioned in the marketing material which is a shame because it would be interesting to know some more about it.

What makes me curious is why there are three pipes. I think I am right in saying that the Douro is awash with family colheitas (and the very few I have tasted have all been excellent) and it would not surprise me if one of those ended up being stored for 150 years in a farmhouse somewhere. But why three pipes? That sounds more commercial and is a larger quantity than could be easily forgotten about in the corner of a cellar. I could imagine three pipes being "found" in a cellar in Vila Nova de Gaia. But perhaps I am wrong and larger quantities are regularly matured in the Douro? Perhaps in the larger estates (Eira Vehla comes to mind, since if these were from Vargellas or the like, I'm sure Taylors would be advertising that fact)? Roy and others will know better than me.