ThePortForum.com

Posted: **17:32 Wed 25 Dec 2013**

Of the three I prefer #3, but acknowledge that it is inferior for packing purposes.

Phil makes excellent points.

Posted: **21:36 Wed 25 Dec 2013**

Hmm. How about:

/TastingNotesStarsNameColsRows [
	(JDAW) 5 1
	(DRT) 5 1
] def

This would give me stars in five columns and one row; DRT the same; and everybody else none. Obviously names could be added, in accordance with expressed preferences.

And, executive decision, authorial privilege:

Thoughts?

Edit: or

Code: Select all

/TastingNotesStarsNameColsRowsArrangement [
	(JDAW) 5 1 /Alternating
	(DRT) 5 1 /Sideways
	(SomebodyElse) 5 1 /OnFeet
] def

thereby allowing any of the star patterns.

Posted: **22:52 Wed 25 Dec 2013**

I much prefer 3. The others make it impossible to circle and exact number of stars without applying significant precision. Such precision is normally impossible during the latter stages of the events where this system would be used. I would go so far as to request a fourth option, being five stars on their feet with a half star gap between each.

Posted: **23:05 Wed 25 Dec 2013**

DRT wrote:I would go so far as to request a fourth option, being five stars on their feet with a half star gap between each.

Is that so different from!

jdaw1 wrote:

That must be easy to circle: ‘arms’ are so thin.

Posted: **23:19 Wed 25 Dec 2013**

Imagine a three-flight, thirty-five bottle tasting. Imagine scoring bottle twelve of flight one and then looking back at that sheet during the WOTN discussion following flight three. Is it a five, is it a four, is it a four and a half?

The principle objective is to persuade lazy people to do something. They might not do it if they have to concentrate on doing it.

Posted: **23:29 Wed 25 Dec 2013**

DRT wrote:They might not do it if they have to concentrate on doing it.

Noted.

Concentration will not be needed. If experience teaches otherwise, things will change.

DRT wrote:Imagine a three-flight, thirty-five bottle tasting.

I am imagining it. Please sir, when? I’m ready.

Posted: **00:34 Fri 27 Dec 2013**

+TastingNotesStarsNameColsRowsArrangement.

Please inspect page 2 of jdawiseman.com/papers/placemat/placemat.pdf, and comment.

Manual not yet updated.

Posted: **00:50 Fri 27 Dec 2013**

Splendid. But the closeness will confuse at least me.

Posted: **18:14 Fri 27 Dec 2013**

Patterns:

= /Alternating

= /Sideways

= /Upright

Current code:

Code: Select all

/TastingNotesStarsNameColsRowsArrangement  % (ASCIIfied Name) NumCols NumRows /Alternating|/Sideways|/Upright
[
	(Julian W.) 5 1 /Alternating
	(JDAW)      5 1 /Alternating
	(Derek T.) 5 1 /Upright
	(DRT)      5 1 /Upright
	(Wolfgang S.) 5 1 /Sideways
	(WPS)         5 1 /Sideways
	(Phil W.) 5 1 /Sideways
	(PW)      5 1 /Sideways
] def  % /TastingNotesStarsNameColsRowsArrangement

(Code extracted updated.)
Willing to add others’ preferences to the default code. (Name absent ⇒ you get no stars.)

Posted: **08:41 Sat 28 Dec 2013**

I can see for some the stars would work, but I wouldn't be a user. The stars should be laid out clearly, but I like the fact they are hollow, which would allow for partial filling-in as some people do with the water boxes.

Posted: **10:47 Sat 28 Dec 2013**

AHB wrote:I can see for some the stars would work, but I wouldn't be a user.

I agree with the first clause, and expected the second.

AHB wrote:The stars should be laid out clearly, but

You appear to be suggesting that they are not ‟laid out clearly”. Please say more.

Posted: **11:50 Sat 28 Dec 2013**

Hard to see how the wine folly tasting mats could be scaled up to a larger tasting and I think that I (as a right-handed person) would have difficulties writing anything by the top left glass (presumably lefties would have problems with even the bottom right).

The stars would be the one element that could be copied but I'm not sure it's particularly needed. Please don't do smilies or "yay"-"boo"!

Posted: **15:29 Sat 28 Dec 2013**

Some of us have lightly grumped at the WineFolly placemats. So, to be fair, let us praise their author for making entertaining wine videos, such as this one about Chardonnay, and this one about ‘The Chocolate Shop’.

Posted: **14:00 Mon 30 Dec 2013**

jdaw1 wrote:
AHB wrote:The stars should be laid out clearly, but
You appear to be suggesting that they are not ‟laid out clearly”. Please say more.

It wasn't intending to imply that they were not laid out clearly. The emphasis in my comment was intended to be on the hollow-ness of the stars - this I like as it easily allows half stars or other fractions limited only by the imagination of the user.

Posted: **14:22 Mon 30 Dec 2013**

AHB wrote:it easily allows half stars or other fractions limited only by the imagination of the user.

Do you want a thin black line at the half-way point, to simplify half stars? Which would need careful placement for the /Sideways ☆s.

Posted: **16:08 Mon 30 Dec 2013**

jdaw1 wrote:
AHB wrote:it easily allows half stars or other fractions limited only by the imagination of the user.
Do you want a thin black line at the half-way point, to simplify half stars? Which would need careful placement for the /Sideways ☆s.

No, I think the user is perfectly able to estimate where the half-way mark would be and to shade or draw such a line for themselves. If you put the line there you are imposing on the user that they can use only halves as their chosen fraction. At least one of us is likely to want to use some proportion of pi.

Posted: **17:11 Mon 30 Dec 2013**

AHB wrote:
jdaw1 wrote:
AHB wrote:it easily allows half stars or other fractions limited only by the imagination of the user.
Do you want a thin black line at the half-way point, to simplify half stars? Which would need careful placement for the /Sideways ☆s.

No, I think the user is perfectly able to estimate where the half-way mark would be and to shade or draw such a line for themselves. If you put the line there you are imposing on the user that they can use only halves as their chosen fraction. At least one of us is likely to want to use some proportion of pi.

At the very least, fifths seems likely.

Posted: **11:00 Thu 09 Jan 2014**

One of the purposes of the stars is to encourage people to score.

And behold DRT’s TN sheet, late in the evening of 8^th January 2014.

Is the plan working?

Posted: **22:21 Sun 26 Jan 2014**

Please add /sideways stars for me when possible.

Posted: **10:53 Mon 27 Jan 2014**

Done, but the request was seen just after the placemats for today’s tasting were printed.

Posted: **00:23 Fri 28 Feb 2014**

This and following two posts were in a new thread called “Placemat software / praise jdaw”, but have been merged by jdaw1 into the thread entitled “Software that makes placemats”.

The placemat software thread, understandably, does not allow me to input expression1.

Jdaw is an artist and a champion of spirit. let it be known. The "Tuesday 18th February 2014, in The Bung Hole, Thirsty at Half term" (is that really how it is to be referred?) viewtopic.php?f=13&p=72379&sid=9536f097 ... 2dc#p72379

Excellent work. Beautifully curated collection!

I would like you to consider attempting full paintings, that the full area be employed to replicate a painting or image, say.

Anyway - You are a beast, and we are continually grateful for your maintenance and improvement of all these wonderful utilities.

Posted: **05:55 Fri 28 Feb 2014**

+1(0000000000)

Posted: **09:00 Fri 28 Feb 2014**

Thank you for the praise. In much of my technical work I insist on both beauty and functionality. Typically they don’t clash.

Matters arising.

There is a thread for discussion of features and bugs, Software that makes placemats. I’m not quite sure what you mean by
Chris Doty wrote:I would like you to consider attempting full paintings, that the full area be employed to replicate a painting or image, say.
so please could a more detailed request be posted in that thread?
This thread does not really belong in the Reference §. Unless there are fierce objections, I’ll move it.
As hint to your own beauty-function drive, links should not include the Session ID. Not sure whether it is actually insecure, but certainly it is redundant.

This and previous two posts were in a new thread called “Placemat software / praise jdaw”, but have been merged by jdaw1 into the thread entitled “Software that makes placemats”.

Posted: **20:45 Wed 05 Mar 2014**

flash_uk, in the thread entitled [url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=72836#p72836]Tue 04 March 2014, 1994 Horizontal, Michael Schuster[/url], wrote:Have noted to self that for future "3rd party" organised tastings, compiling a generic placemat using a well-known high quality piece of software would be a sensible step. As it happened, 1-14 scribbled on the back of some A4 did the trick, but there were a few moments where things almost got muddled.

jdaw1, in reply, wrote:I had reached a similar conclusion. And as we knew the Ports in advance, I really had no excuse. Next time we’ll show up with the paperwork.

Might www.jdawiseman.com/2014/201403_generic_a4.pdf assist?

Keep a copy in your briefcase at all times. And if you love your pals, include multiple copies of the first eight pages.

Posted: **21:59 Wed 05 Mar 2014**

jdaw1 wrote:Might www.jdawiseman.com/2014/201403_generic_a4.pdf assist?

Keep a copy in your briefcase at all times. And if you love your pals, include multiple copies of the first eight pages.

Splendid. Exactly what I had in mind. JDAW gets

Posted: **10:42 Thu 06 Mar 2014**

For our American friends I have added www.jdawiseman.com/2014/201403_generic_usl.pdf.

Links to the two versions:
• /A4 = (250mm÷√√2) × (250mm×√√2) ≈ 210mm × 297mm;
• /USL = 8½″ × 11″ = 215.9mm × 279.4mm.

Posted: **20:15 Thu 20 Mar 2014**

Flash has drawn my attention to TheVintagePortSite.com/view.php?id=13820, saying “seems like the placemat is famous”.

TheVintagePortSite.com wrote:

Initially I thought that the Symingtons were using the software, but this was actually made by our very own SushiNorth for the Dow vertical in New York on Saturday 19^th March 2011.

Posted: **21:41 Thu 20 Mar 2014**

Ah. But where did the photo get picked up, as there is none on the thread?

Posted: **22:38 Thu 20 Mar 2014**

Not my photo, as my placemats at that tasting had the "old" flight on the left. Perhaps Sushi's or G-man's?

Posted: **10:24 Fri 21 Mar 2014**

Tasting notes on the left suggests a left-hander, but none of the placemat pages are left-handed.

Posted: **15:17 Fri 21 Mar 2014**

jdaw1 wrote:Tasting notes on the left suggests a left-hander, but none of the placemat pages are left-handed.

We're typically pretty crowded at the ACPT tastings, so the notes on the left could belong to the taster on the left. Inconclusive, I think.

Posted: **18:26 Fri 21 Mar 2014**

jdaw1 wrote:Flash has drawn my attention to TheVintagePortSite.com/view.php?id=13820, saying “seems like the placemat is famous”.
Initially I thought that the Symingtons were using the software, but this was actually made by our very own SushiNorth for the Dow vertical in New York on Saturday 19^th March 2011.

Well that's pretty cool -- but I merely used JDaw's software for the mats. The origin of the picture is far more interesting -- I have been unable to find it amongst my set, which means it likely came from a different attendee.

Posted: **21:09 Fri 28 Mar 2014**

It seems that I am no longer able to make use of this section of code:

Code: Select all

/PackingDirectionVertical /TopToBottom def  % /TopToBottom /BottomToTop
/PackingDirectionHorizontal /LeftToRight def  % /LeftToRight /RightToLeft
/PackingNestingColumnMajor false def

No matter how I alter the parameters, the result is that the first glass in the list is top left, the last glass is bottom right, and rows are filled before columns.

Previous discussion in this thread indicated that simply setting /PackingNestingColumnMajor true def would reverse the order of the rows. That is to say, the first glass would be bottom left, the last glass would be top right, and rows would be filled before columns. Based on the naming convention I suspect that isn't true, but regardless making that change seems to have no effect.

I have tried both /PackingNestingColumnMajor true def and /PackingDirectionVertical /BottomToTop def but end up with the same output in either case. I have tried it both using the placemats that I'm trying to create, and finally just to be sure I hadn't messed something up elsewhere I have tried it using the baseline software downloaded fresh from www.jdawiseman.com/placemat.

Posted: **21:54 Fri 28 Mar 2014**

Since these were written, much of the relevant code has changed. An error is entirely possible. Please email me the code.

Glenn E. wrote:Previous discussion in this thread indicated that simply setting /PackingNestingColumnMajor true def would reverse the order of the rows.

That parameter should switch the ordering of the loops, i.e. whether “rows would be filled before columns” or the reverse.

Glenn E. wrote:I have tried both /PackingNestingColumnMajor true def and /PackingDirectionVertical /BottomToTop def but end up with the same output in either case.

Unless you are using positions supplied as an array, or one of the other PermittedPackingStyles in which this request would make no sense, it is my bug. Please email your code.

Posted: **22:01 Fri 28 Mar 2014**

My bug: sorry.

These option still exist, and still work, but as a flag within PermittedPackingStyles. The bug was forgetting to delete the three lines in which the no-longer-used parameters were set. So you might want something like

Code: Select all

/PermittedPackingStyles [
	[ /RectangularDislocation /PackingNestingColumnMajor true /PackingDirectionTopToBottom false ]
] def

Just uploaded, a new version of the code without the three redundant lines.

Posted: **22:36 Fri 28 Mar 2014**

jdaw1 wrote:
Glenn E. wrote:Previous discussion in this thread indicated that simply setting /PackingNestingColumnMajor true def would reverse the order of the rows.
That parameter should switch the ordering of the loops, i.e. whether “rows would be filled before columns” or the reverse.

This is what I expected based on the name. The earlier discussion, then, was in error. This is the preferred outcome: code > discussion.

Posted: **22:38 Fri 28 Mar 2014**

jdaw1 wrote:My bug: sorry.

These option still exist, and still work, but as a flag within PermittedPackingStyles. The bug was forgetting to delete the three lines in which the no-longer-used parameters were set. So you might want something like
Code: Select all
/PermittedPackingStyles [
	[ /RectangularDislocation /PackingNestingColumnMajor true /PackingDirectionTopToBottom false ]
] def
Just uploaded, a new version of the code without the three redundant lines.

Excellent, thank you. I will go attempt the following:

Code: Select all

/PermittedPackingStyles [
	[ /Diamonds /PackingNestingColumnMajor false /PackingDirectionTopToBottom false ]
] def

My desire is RowMajor, BottomToTop.

Posted: **22:40 Fri 28 Mar 2014**

I believe that I have lately used the code you intend to use, and it has worked just dandy.

Posted: **22:45 Fri 28 Mar 2014**

Glenn E. wrote:I will go attempt the following:
Code: Select all
/PermittedPackingStyles [
	[ /Diamonds /PackingNestingColumnMajor false /PackingDirectionTopToBottom false ]
] def
My desire is RowMajor, BottomToTop.

Then the “/PackingNestingColumnMajor false” is redundant, IIRC.

Posted: **22:55 Fri 28 Mar 2014**

Success; thank you for the help.

Posted: **22:56 Fri 28 Mar 2014**

And thank you for the bug report.

Posted: **12:23 Sun 30 Mar 2014**

Do you go up or down?

The placemats produced for this small meeting occasioned a slight discolouration of the man who made the software. He expressed his disdain for a placemat which goes upwards from the bottom left on the glasses page, and yet downwards from the top on the tasting note page. He also communicated a concern that users would become confused.

Does anybody else have an opinion?

Posted: **12:44 Sun 30 Mar 2014**

[url=http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=73630#p73630]Here[/url] djewesbury wrote:

djewesbury, responding by PM to an observation of jdaw1, wrote:I like to go up and across from the left. You prefer to do the opposite. Thus, for me, the first and youngest wine is at the bottom of the glasses page and the top of the TN page.

jdaw1, replying by PM, wrote:Going down one page whilst up the other seems, to my simple mind, more confusing than going through both in the same direction.

djewesbury, replying by PM, wrote:I can understand your logic. All I can say is that I want to backwards in my glasses and downwards in my TNs. This is a valuable experiment in literacy, facilitated by Port!

Posted: **19:51 Sun 30 Mar 2014**

I most certainly prefer to go downwards in my notes, it assists not smudging notes made previously.

However, I have observed that on many occasions I will pick glasses out based on something other than the order in which they are placed on the sheet - apparent evolutionary age, for example.

But when I follow the order in which the glasses are placed, I prefer to work from the top left to top right and then down the page. I find this tends to minimise my chances of spilling, knocking over or trying to return glasses to spaces which are occupied. I am at my most sober when trying to get glasses from furthest away and at my least sober when dealing with the glasses that are closest to me.

Posted: **19:55 Sun 30 Mar 2014**

If others contribute their opinions and the general consensus is that I am plain bonkers, then I am happy to redo my placemat. Flash, what do you think?

Posted: **20:05 Sun 30 Mar 2014**

I tend to grab the nearest glass first! I agree with Alex that note-taking starting at the top and working down is preferable, so I have a mild preference for the DJ approach. I can work with any layout, but will start with the tasting notes and find the glass rather than the other way round.

Posted: **20:19 Sun 30 Mar 2014**

I think the TNs would start at the top no matter what. JDAW's initial complaint was that, this being invariable, the glasses pages should follow the same order. I would perhaps agree that in a large tasting it might be better to work forwards. But I disagree that anyone could become confused. I think we are all sufficiently adept at recognising names and reading across from a page laid out in a diagrammatic way to one that is organised in a tabular format.

Posted: **20:28 Sun 30 Mar 2014**

As I am not Chinese I prefer to work my way through from top left to bottom right.

The order in which TNs appear on a page rarely affects my general well being.

Posted: **20:41 Sun 30 Mar 2014**

In common layouts I would start top left, then either working across the rows (mostly) or down the columns as appropriate. On some non-standard layouts there could be variation, for example an arch of glasses on A3 using placemat as centre, but these would be the special cases.

Posted: **20:43 Sun 30 Mar 2014**

PhilW wrote:an arch of glasses on A3

FYI, an example (and more):

ThePortForum.com

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